DEPICTING IT AS-IS AND CONFRONTING THE TIMES

―――Was the film adaptation in the works for some time?

The initial talk first came up just before the SEED TV series ended. There was a discussion of “Should we make one more movie to finish it off?” But what I had conceived then ended up incorporated into DESTINY. So, around the summer before DESTINY ended (the final episode aired October 1, 2005), talk of making it into a movie came up again, and that’s when I started thinking about it. So, for me, it feels more like “it’s finally taking shape.”

―――Nearly two decades later, has your approach to the work changed?

I don’t think it’s changed that much. However, there are aspects that inevitably had to change to keep pace with the times.

―――Could you elaborate?

Nobody wants anything extreme nowadays. Since we, of course, don’t know wars of the past from experience, we can only think about them through books, newsreels, and imagination. But I grapple with whether providing that as entertainment for minors is right? I have misgivings, of course. Both SEED and DESTINY delve into the roots of war, framing them within relatable human relationships, making them particularly intense. I don’t think society today would tolerate it.

―――Do you think the times being what they were back then allowed it to be tolerated?

Absolutely, it’s a sign of the times. War is a constant in any era (back then, it was the Iraq War following 9/11, the Afghan conflict). What happens in war is only tragic. If that becomes entertainment, it’s the end of the world. What matters is what you depict through war, and you have to portray the underlying foolishness as foolish. In that sense, some allowance for extreme expression back then was part of the times, but even that wouldn’t be permitted now.

―――In circumstances like that, what will you do?

I’ll depict it as-is. Just confront people with, “Is that kind of societal trend acceptable?” When you boil it down, manga and anime are, in the end, akin to junk food, a sort of guilty pleasure. Nowadays, people question, “Is this acceptable as a form of expression?” but I think adults shouldn’t make a big fuss about the snacks kids enjoy. Or rather, they shouldn’t be watching anime at their age.

―――A counterculture, then.

Manga and anime are rebellions against societal norms. While adults deem literature and artworks as mainstream entertainment, manga and anime are the antitheses, daring to illustrate the taboo. They’re shady, erotic, and, in a sense, cruel. Masters like Osamu Tezuka, Go Nagai, and my favorite George Akiyama, were all like that. ‘There’s more than one way to see the world’ is the message manga and anime should convey. Though they’ve somehow been pushed to mainstream culture, I keep in mind their essence isn’t forgotten when creating my works. I love these mediums that defy societal norms, which is why I do this job. Of course, being a profession, if it doesn’t resonate with many, it won’t bring in the money either.

THE NEW WORKS THEME EXPLORES THE RIGHT TO LOVE AND BE LOVED

―――In SEED, the main characters had a clear intention to stop the war.

In SEED, there was an assertion that one “shouldn’t fight.” But with DESTINY, it’s more of an ironic question: “Is it truly wrong to fight?” DESTINY serves as a counter-argument to SEED. It doesn’t denounce the act of fighting. Hope for tomorrow, the drive to achieve one’s desires—they come through struggle, through battle. At the time, people were beginning to say we should stop ranking in races or stop competing altogether. A blanket rejection of anything connected to war and conflict felt misguided to me. When you only see justice from one perspective, it inevitably ends up skewed. There are many people’s sense of justice, and you must acknowledge them to some degree to coexist. I really like how Moonlight Mask refers to being an “ally” of justice, not “justice” itself. There’s a pause, a restraint—something fundamental in hero narratives. The idea that it doesn’t claim absolute righteousness is appealing.

―――The SEED TV Series gained a new fanbase.

This movie is aimed mainly at long-time fans. To put it bluntly, I’m making what I want to watch.

―――Is it an antithesis to the previous two works?

Well… it’s more of a connection. Essentially, I’m asking, “Is there a prerequisite to loving someone?” Do those deemed unworthy remain unloved? The right to love and the value of being loved—that’s the essence I’m hoping to encapsulate in the story.

WHAT IS “GUNDAM?”

―――What do you as a director consider the “Gundam” series to be?

If I’m being blunt, it started as nothing more than a robot-themed toy promotion. But with ‘Gundam’ in the title, there’s this expectation to deliver ‘Gundam,’ you know. Personally, I’ve always adhered to the policy of not creating anything that isn’t “Gundam.”

―――What would make it “not Gundam”?

The moment it delves into politics, it ceases to be ‘Gundam.’ What was good about the original “Mobile Suit Gundam” was how at the end, Amuro says, ‘I still have a place to return to,’ and goes back to the White Base kids. Plus, Char and Amuro fought outside the context of the war, and within that, there was a moment where Char said, “Then become my comrade!” Though I did think, ‘Not now, man’ (laughs). It’s the way it concludes on a personal note that gets to me.

―――You’re right; the main character didn’t end the war.

War narratives aren’t exactly feel-good material. I don’t mind showing discomfort to highlight the feel-good aspects, though. But looking back through history, wars have never made anything better. Yet humanity’s foolishness makes us wage them anyway. But, portraying this as entertainment can be misinterpreted as exploiting human lives and tragedies. I myself don’t want to watch such things. That’s why I substitute a child’s perspective, recasting it as familiar human drama and focusing on the children’s relationships. At the time, it dealt with issues of belonging. The war itself was merely a backbone, a background. The conclusion wasn’t the end of the war but the endpoint for the characters. That’s how I approached it. To make it “Gundam,” I prepared many stage settings for “what’s necessary.”

BY THE ACTION SCENES, THE DRAMA IS ALREADY OVER

But we use various sci-fi elements like Minovsky particles to make the unrealistic war work, so it would be strange not to have battles between mobile suits. If you think realistically, having a white mobile suit on the battlefield is odd, or whether they need to be bipedal at all… Because we use those things to make the mobile suit battles exciting highlights, not having those battles isn’t an option. So while “Gundam” is dressed up as a war story, at its heart, it’s a “robot story.”

―――What’s crucial for robot action?

If robot action isn’t exhilarating, it’s pointless. I’ve said this many times, but robot action is similar to depicting “night.” Once the action begins, it’s all about executing it. The drama is in the anticipation, the ‘will they, won’t they’ stage. It’s all about how much they can elevate each other’s emotions beforehand. That sets the catharsis of the battle, you see.

―――Sometimes, the fight starts, but they abruptly stop.

That’s like hesitating because the mood isn’t there, you know? When both are cornered, and there’s no turning back, it ends in a real kill-or-be-killed situation. But if we don’t depict that, the sheer tragedy of war doesn’t come across. In that despair, there’s a kind of catharsis, isn’t there? Both Kira and Athrun have to experience the death of someone close to drive that home.

―――By the way, did you watch The Witch from Mercury?

No, I haven’t. While I’m working on the movie, I avoid watching other Gundam titles. If I did, their essence would inevitably seep into me. I try not to let the souls of other ‘Gundams’ enter me. Don’t want to be influenced, you see.